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  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jul 2019
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    pox is on a distinguished road

    Surrender to Madnes+Life Swap=Bae

    Lets do a healthy dose of theorycraft debate here. For those of you who have never heard of it, there was a spell, before legion, that was so terryfying to wow players that none of them even dared to point a finger at the players that would wield it. Keywboards were smashed, computers thrown out of windows, and endless amount of electronics sent in for repairs due to acts of frustration due to the power from this very spell.

    Itís name was Surrender to Madness. It (used to) give you a 200% boost to insanity generation. AND you were able to cast while moving. And this effect lasted for 1 entire minute. Itís effect to move while casting for 1 minute were unique for the shadow priest, and shrouded in mystery. For this reason, shadow priests were dreaded and feared as the class that held access to this spell; the most powerful spell in the game.

    Now you may think; is it really that powerful? Think again, fool. While you are in shadowform, you get a 20% increase in all damage you deal. And why is that so interesting? Because when you have this talent of todayís topic, as long as you keep up your DoTís and apply pressure on targets, this greatly affects the amount of time that you can spend in voidform. The insanity generation makes the time it takes for you to consume all of the voidform take much longer. Also, voidform has no cooldown, which means that since the bar fills in no-time during itís activatity, you basically have 1 entire minute of voidform. During this time, you can also move while casting spells AND you get the 20% damage bonus from voidform. The insanity bonus used to be 200%, now itís nerfed to 100%. But from one point of view, it doesnít matter all that much since you will be able to be in voidform all of this time.

    HOWEVER. There is one big BUT nowÖ After you have forsailed the curse, the spirits come back to haunt you. And you lose 90% of your health.

    The soultion to this could be to use void shift, formely known as life swap. It lets you swap health with an ally. You get their health, they get yours. Simple as that. This is fair and legal :smiley:

    So now to the discussion. I want your advice what you guys think of this spell. What makes it viable? If not, what are the not so great aspects of it? And most specificly, what are the benefits of using this spell, in compared to others?

  2. #2
    I think the real kicker here, is that the spell states that you take 90% of you MAX hp, so unless you are at max hp you will for sure die I assume. then if you are lucky enough to have not died THEN you get to life swap. seems like a spell that can win the match or lose it at the same time. But id be interested in trying it out to see if the damage output outweighs the event of you dying. Ive never given it a chance since ive always chose to go with the most consistent pick

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Sep 2018
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    Ideas like this is what makes the game fun for me, Having random thoughts like this to make a spec seem more viable than it actually is.

    There's a lot of things like this in the game, like outlaw rogues and certain specs for ferals like Savage roar etc. However Surrender to madness has too many bad variables for something to go wrong, if your partner isnt at 100% hp, you'll simply just die, or you miss time it and you dont get the life-swap off

    This seems like a fun thing, but it has no real use in serious pvp

    In bg's however, this seems like the most fun thing ever and if i mained shadow i'd use it every game just to make being trained bearable by moving while casting

  4. #4

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    Jul 2017
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    The issue with surrender to madness and why it's no longer used is not only because of the 90% max health damage you take, but the major flaw is that as shadow now you don't actually gain a huge advantage by extending your void form - in fact in pve it's actually a damage loss to stay in it too long as you're delaying both chorus of insanity as well as lingering insanity to gain nothing

    Why is it bad? - Shadow used to have a trait called mass hysteria which would increase your dot damage with every stack of void form you had, meaning it was very advantageous to aim for long void forms and stay inside for as long as possible, now with the removal of mass hysteria you are actually not gaining much for staying inside voidform for extended periods, couple this with how easy it is to gain the insanity to get back into voidforrm and it really diminishes the talent further -- Then add the fact you're doing pvp into the equation, so one interrupt, one cc, one player line of sighting, add any of these very common occurrences that happen in pvp and you'll instantly drop out of voidform if you are at a decent amount of stacks and then suffer 90% of your health.

    Not to mention you lose the ability to enter voidform at 60% insanity as well as 5% increase to your overall damage and you can see why it's not very favourable in either pvp or pve right now.

    As for the saving void shift for it, you are trading an extremely strong defensive for both you and your team for next to no gain from surrender, although the abiity is extremely fun it's just sadly not ever going to be viable in either pvp or pve at it's current state, even if the 90% damage was removed it still wouldn't be picked up sadly.

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