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  1. #1

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    Xenn is on a distinguished road

    Tips for Rogue/Mage

    Hello,

    This is mostly question for Zenzy as its about 2v2 and you seem to be the right man for it.

    I've seen most of the videos on the website and read some of the stuff you post in 2v2 sections but me and my mage seem to struggle around 1.9-2k mmr. We are both around 430 ilvl, mostly playing with 1 offensive trinket and 1 defensive (i.e. Safeguard)

    1. I can't seem to get a grip on "how to sub" as a rogue. As Assa, I can go against any assa rogue so far and win most of the time. Same goes for other classes if I'm left with a 1v1 situation. As a Sub rogue, I seem to struggle a lot. Is there something that I need to do to perform better? Like trait that I have must have, essence? I usually use either Crucible of Flame or Conflict and Strife for both specs.
    I started farming Blood of the Enemy today to see if RANK 3 can give me a bit more burst. Same question for Fire mages.

    2. I enjoy both rogue specs and really wanted to be a sub rogue but it seems really difficult. My mage seems to have similar issue with fire. He prefers to be a frost mage and whenever we try to go sub/fire we seem to loose more than we are wining.

    3. We seem to struggle against comps with Rogues, Boomkins, Warlocks and Mages. Usually the DPS is the problem and we either get peeled off the healer or one of us just dies.

    4. If we don't win in the opener or at least first 40 sec to a minute we seem to just run and peel of each other until we die... horribly -.-

    I've seen some of your replies and I'm looking forward to hear from you. There isn't many sub videos on the website as sub is not flavour of the month.

    Cheers
    Last edited by Xenn; 10-23-2019 at 05:37 PM.

  2. #2

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    2k mmr with only 430 ilvl as double dps seems very good...

    In Xaryu Nashj videos it's amazing how long they survive just peeling, going for food etc... Until they can do a new go. Maybe it's the key, be able to survive long enough to setup 2 or 3 "go" ?

  3. #3

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    Well we seem to be able to survive maximum to a third kidney. But that depends on a match up. I've check some of the Xaryu's videos but can't really find anything good from Nahj (I might be retarded xd)

  4. #4

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    Zenzy is on a distinguished road
    Heya!

    I'll start 1 by 1

    1) Sub doesnt allow for as many mistakes as assa does, meaning if you make 1-2 mistakes during a game it shows REALLY hard in comparison to assa, as you'll probably lose from it. That being said, sub rogue in my opinion is one of the best classes to win a 1v1 with, you can reset whenever you want, you have access to unlimited stuns.
    As i said above though, once you make a mistake its hard to come back from it.
    It's quite a different playstyle compared to assa too, you have to Cover-stun to help your mage get sheeps (Meaning kidney on healer and cheapshot on dps)
    Blood of the enemy is kinda mandetory for sub at the minute, every sub rogue i've played with and against has used it just because of how much raw damage you can pull of during it. However conflict major is completely fine.
    I wouldnt pick flame major as sub as you'll find it hard to get the globals in during your damage windows.

    2) If you're trying to play sub/dps in 2's its a lot about Setups and waiting for the right opportunity, aswell as LONG CC chains thanks to how much stuff you have as rogue. Kidney > sheep > re-sap > re-sap > blind > shadowy duel on trinket > Kidney again.
    My advice for you is to practise these comps, forget about rating and just know what to do into certain classes, that's how i learnt rogue!
    I played over 800 2s games before i was even 2200 in 2's on my rogue (I'm a slow learner haha but i did learn sub in the process!)
    If you really want to learn sub, my advice for you is to find a sub rogue streamer and watch their vods. My go-to would be Twitch.tv/sfuryx - Although he doesnt stream very often you can watch his vods and you'll learn from one of the best and only sub rogues EU (Avidance)


    3) By you saying this i already notice one big problem, you're training healers! It's not ideal to only train healers and hope for the best, yes this may work against some people. However others you need to CC the healer and do go's on the Dps and i bet you already know how to do your cc chain!
    You can have some games where you start on the dps, get some cd's and do a hard swap on the healer, that's fine. However just from reading this point i fear that you're only game plan is trying to kill healers which as i said isnt ideal!

    4) Read above ^

    5) There's a sub/sv video on its way, i think watching that will give you some hope on playing sub rogue as in that comp as the rogue there's not many things you need to do, and once you get your specific job down you're GOLDEN!
    Also about your trinkets, sometimes its worth using double offensive trinket just to end the game faster, for example a fury warrior can only kill you during stuns and there's no real need for a safeguard, as you can avoid a lot of his damage by using your step / sprint / evasion correctly!

    hope i could help !

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Zenzy View Post
    Heya!

    I'll start 1 by 1

    1) Sub doesnt allow for as many mistakes as assa does, meaning if you make 1-2 mistakes during a game it shows REALLY hard in comparison to assa, as you'll probably lose from it. That being said, sub rogue in my opinion is one of the best classes to win a 1v1 with, you can reset whenever you want, you have access to unlimited stuns.
    As i said above though, once you make a mistake its hard to come back from it.
    It's quite a different playstyle compared to assa too, you have to Cover-stun to help your mage get sheeps (Meaning kidney on healer and cheapshot on dps)
    Blood of the enemy is kinda mandetory for sub at the minute, every sub rogue i've played with and against has used it just because of how much raw damage you can pull of during it. However conflict major is completely fine.
    I wouldnt pick flame major as sub as you'll find it hard to get the globals in during your damage windows.

    2) If you're trying to play sub/dps in 2's its a lot about Setups and waiting for the right opportunity, aswell as LONG CC chains thanks to how much stuff you have as rogue. Kidney > sheep > re-sap > re-sap > blind > shadowy duel on trinket > Kidney again.
    My advice for you is to practise these comps, forget about rating and just know what to do into certain classes, that's how i learnt rogue!
    I played over 800 2s games before i was even 2200 in 2's on my rogue (I'm a slow learner haha but i did learn sub in the process!)
    If you really want to learn sub, my advice for you is to find a sub rogue streamer and watch their vods. My go-to would be Twitch.tv/sfuryx - Although he doesnt stream very often you can watch his vods and you'll learn from one of the best and only sub rogues EU (Avidance)


    3) By you saying this i already notice one big problem, you're training healers! It's not ideal to only train healers and hope for the best, yes this may work against some people. However others you need to CC the healer and do go's on the Dps and i bet you already know how to do your cc chain!
    You can have some games where you start on the dps, get some cd's and do a hard swap on the healer, that's fine. However just from reading this point i fear that you're only game plan is trying to kill healers which as i said isnt ideal!

    4) Read above ^

    5) There's a sub/sv video on its way, i think watching that will give you some hope on playing sub rogue as in that comp as the rogue there's not many things you need to do, and once you get your specific job down you're GOLDEN!
    Also about your trinkets, sometimes its worth using double offensive trinket just to end the game faster, for example a fury warrior can only kill you during stuns and there's no real need for a safeguard, as you can avoid a lot of his damage by using your step / sprint / evasion correctly!

    hope i could help !
    This twitch don't exists!

  6. #6

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    Oh sorry!!!

    https://www.twitch.tv/sfurytv

    However i just realised he deleted all the vods :X. Sorry

  7. #7

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    Zenzy, I forgot to thank you again. You are the legend among men.
    Cheers ^^

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